Some questions, like some insight.
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Ape Man
Senior Forum User
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2006 9:26 am Posts: 1947 Location: Fergus, ON
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Some questions, like some insight.
Already fellow apes. I am looking ahead to next spring, and seeing my Trans-Am, and how I want to do something different to it. I have a few options laid out.
Option 1 :
Camshaft-ValveTrain upgrades (Springs, lifters, chain, pushrods and oilpump)
-Id likley go with a 220/220/114lsa, I'd love to run a 112LSA, but from what I have read I want to be about -8* overlap at .050" for the sniffer tests. (Can always lower it 100rpm on the idle to give me more raunch)
Idle quality :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7EBu4pCvZs
Pros to this :
-Sexy idle
-Power
-Able to say I have a cammed LS1
Cons :
-Pricey
-Motor has 260,000KM on it
-Its running so nice now I'd hate to tear into it and cause issues
-My stock Clutch will likley tell me to F-Off shortly after a few WOT runs
Option 2 :
My exhaust sounds good, but I'd like a little louder, currently running :
Longtubes -> OR-Y -> 3" Midpipe into a Magnaflow with boom tubes.
I will have to cat the Y at the end of next year for an emission test, so I was debating a Chambered setup like a GMMG. The cats should take away the rasp, and it'll be louder for sure, then I could run some quad tailpipes kinda like this :
Uploaded with ImageShack.us
GMMG :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vK4A7C0XYZw
Pros to this :
-Cheaper then cam
-Less risk of stuff going wrong
-Sound sexy
Cons :
-Its not a cam.
_________________ 2002 Pontaic Trans-Am WS.6
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Thu Oct 14, 2010 9:31 am |
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flame
CCFBG Club Member
Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2006 8:52 pm Posts: 1164 Location: Drayton
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I guess it really depends whether you want more power or just sound. I'm running the TR224 114LSA and have no probs with etest. It makes good usable power for everyday driving and runs 12.15 in the 1/4. Yes your stock clutch will not like the extra power so plan on swapping that shortly after.
_________________
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Thu Oct 14, 2010 11:11 am |
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Mr Bastard
CCFBG Club Member
Joined: Sat Mar 19, 2005 8:07 pm Posts: 4327 Location: The big town
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Doesn't matter you will sell it before then anyways
_________________9.06@155 mph, small block pump gas with 3.42's bird 8.14@166 mph, big block on 250 shot monza
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Thu Oct 14, 2010 11:16 am |
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Ape Man
Senior Forum User
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2006 9:26 am Posts: 1947 Location: Fergus, ON
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flame wrote: I guess it really depends whether you want more power or just sound. I'm running the TR224 114LSA and have no probs with etest. It makes good usable power for everyday driving and runs 12.15 in the 1/4. Yes your stock clutch will not like the extra power so plan on swapping that shortly after.
Really after the sound.
_________________ 2002 Pontaic Trans-Am WS.6
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Thu Oct 14, 2010 11:23 am |
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cam
Senior Forum User
Joined: Sun May 13, 2007 10:48 am Posts: 984
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Doing a cam swap without the exhaust to support it is kind of a waste. You'll gain 20-30 with that cam but add the headers and you can add at least another 30. These engines like RPM and the manifolds will really hold you back up top.
Second vote for the TR224 however. Its a great cam and regardless of 220 or 224 you wont pass emissions with a decent power tune you need to retard timing to pass so might as well get the good one and go
_________________ 1987 IROC ww 99 LS1,TR224/112, STG2 heads ported by American Speed, P Gold springs, LS6 intake, SVO 30's, Ported TB, Comp Cromo Push rods, Katech Rod bolts, LS6 oil pump, T56, SW LT's, 8.8 hybrid rear 3.73, 275/40/17 MT ET streets, lots more
12.1 @ 112 mph 1.69 60'
89 R7U 1LE Players Challenge car all stock.
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Thu Oct 14, 2010 11:59 am |
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flame
CCFBG Club Member
Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2006 8:52 pm Posts: 1164 Location: Drayton
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cam wrote: Doing a cam swap without the exhaust to support it is kind of a waste. You'll gain 20-30 with that cam but add the headers and you can add at least another 30. These engines like RPM and the manifolds will really hold you back up top.
Second vote for the TR224 however. Its a great cam and regardless of 220 or 224 you wont pass emissions with a decent power tune you need to retard timing to pass so might as well get the good one and go
He already has headers on the car. For the etest all I did was bump the idle up to 1150. I probably could have left it alone and still passed but who wants to give the gov more money if it happened to fail.
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Thu Oct 14, 2010 12:20 pm |
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Ape Man
Senior Forum User
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2006 9:26 am Posts: 1947 Location: Fergus, ON
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Arun that used to work at Champion has been giving me some insight, he has a 224/228 114LSA, and can tune it for me, and yes car already has a FAST intake and Full exhaust.
_________________ 2002 Pontaic Trans-Am WS.6
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Thu Oct 14, 2010 1:00 pm |
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Mark99Hawk
Forum Moderator
Joined: Wed Oct 25, 2006 7:08 pm Posts: 144
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I have a 220/224 cam on a 114...no e-test issues but it does need the higher idle to pass. I did try it with the stock idle - 3x the limit (oops?). That's with the large magnaflow cats too.
Maybe I should pull it out and sell it to you and go bigger?
Keep in mind any cam you are pretty much going to need to raise the idle to get it to pass an e-test every 2 years. So factor in the cost of hptuners to the cam purchase.
Btw...the cam install isn't that expensive if you stay low on the lift. Mine is 551 lift so I run the Z06 springs which are only $75 for the set from the dealer.
Mark
_________________'99 Red Firehawk C069
One of 97 that never left Canada in '99
Lots of SLP options
Sold - '97 Cayenne Red Z28
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Thu Oct 14, 2010 1:31 pm |
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Ape Man
Senior Forum User
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2006 9:26 am Posts: 1947 Location: Fergus, ON
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Mark99Hawk wrote: I have a 220/224 cam on a 114...no e-test issues but it does need the higher idle to pass. I did try it with the stock idle - 3x the limit (oops?). That's with the large magnaflow cats too. Maybe I should pull it out and sell it to you and go bigger? Keep in mind any cam you are pretty much going to need to raise the idle to get it to pass an e-test every 2 years. So factor in the cost of hptuners to the cam purchase. Btw...the cam install isn't that expensive if you stay low on the lift. Mine is 551 lift so I run the Z06 springs which are only $75 for the set from the dealer. Mark
Any idle clips of yours Mark? and Yes id buy it from you
Parts id replace :
Cam
Valvesprings
Pushrods
My buddy owns a shop in town and we could do it there on a weekend. Just yank subframe down, clean everything up, swap in my new oil psi switch and install the new goodies and reinstall. Also Arun will be doing all the tuning for me on the car.
So itll be not THAT pricey, my clutch is a LUK and is like 20,000km on it, uits like new. So id go till it was cooked, then install new one later on, so just cam/springs/pushrods shouldnt be pricey.
Should I do timing chain (260,000km on motor)
_________________ 2002 Pontaic Trans-Am WS.6
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Thu Oct 14, 2010 1:36 pm |
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Mark99Hawk
Forum Moderator
Joined: Wed Oct 25, 2006 7:08 pm Posts: 144
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Ape Man wrote: Any idle clips of yours Mark? and Yes id buy it from you Parts id replace : Cam Valvesprings Pushrods My buddy owns a shop in town and we could do it there on a weekend. Just yank subframe down, clean everything up, swap in my new oil psi switch and install the new goodies and reinstall. Also Arun will be doing all the tuning for me on the car.
I still have stock pushrods...with the Z06 springs you don't need the upgraded ones. Any heavier springs though and I would. Or if you plan to turn higher than stock RPM I would too
No need to drop the subframe...can just pull the rad...I did mine in my garage on jackstands in a day and a half by myself.
Mark
_________________'99 Red Firehawk C069
One of 97 that never left Canada in '99
Lots of SLP options
Sold - '97 Cayenne Red Z28
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Thu Oct 14, 2010 1:42 pm |
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Ape Man
Senior Forum User
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2006 9:26 am Posts: 1947 Location: Fergus, ON
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Mark99Hawk wrote: Ape Man wrote: Any idle clips of yours Mark? and Yes id buy it from you Parts id replace : Cam Valvesprings Pushrods My buddy owns a shop in town and we could do it there on a weekend. Just yank subframe down, clean everything up, swap in my new oil psi switch and install the new goodies and reinstall. Also Arun will be doing all the tuning for me on the car. Nice, Prob. easier to do it that way. So when you selling me yours Any idle clips? I still have stock pushrods...with the Z06 springs you don't need the upgraded ones. Any heavier springs though and I would. Or if you plan to turn higher than stock RPM I would too No need to drop the subframe...can just pull the rad...I did mine in my garage on jackstands in a day and a half by myself. Mark
When can I buy yours?
Ill prob. just do it that way again. Also, any idle clips buddy?
_________________ 2002 Pontaic Trans-Am WS.6
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Thu Oct 14, 2010 1:49 pm |
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cam
Senior Forum User
Joined: Sun May 13, 2007 10:48 am Posts: 984
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Ape Man wrote: Arun that used to work at Champion has been giving me some insight, he has a 224/228 114LSA, and can tune it for me, and yes car already has a FAST intake and Full exhaust.
Thats a good lift for your combo especially with the FAST. What lobes are they?
Id run LSL lobes or EPS lobes if you order new. Marks cam is very smooth Ive been in his car its a great street cam as well.
Im not a fan of the stock pushrods even with stock cams. Ive pulled appart a few LS engines now and seen more than one bent in stock use. Pushrods are not pricey either so Id do it.
Mind you the yellow Z06 springs are excellent if you can get away with running them they last a very long time
_________________ 1987 IROC ww 99 LS1,TR224/112, STG2 heads ported by American Speed, P Gold springs, LS6 intake, SVO 30's, Ported TB, Comp Cromo Push rods, Katech Rod bolts, LS6 oil pump, T56, SW LT's, 8.8 hybrid rear 3.73, 275/40/17 MT ET streets, lots more
12.1 @ 112 mph 1.69 60'
89 R7U 1LE Players Challenge car all stock.
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Thu Oct 14, 2010 1:58 pm |
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Ape Man
Senior Forum User
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2006 9:26 am Posts: 1947 Location: Fergus, ON
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cam wrote: Ape Man wrote: Arun that used to work at Champion has been giving me some insight, he has a 224/228 114LSA, and can tune it for me, and yes car already has a FAST intake and Full exhaust. Thats a good lift for your combo especially with the FAST. What lobes are they? Id run LSL lobes or EPS lobes if you order new. Marks cam is very smooth Ive been in his car its a great street cam as well. Im not a fan of the stock pushrods even with stock cams. Ive pulled appart a few LS engines now and seen more than one bent in stock use. Pushrods are not pricey either so Id do it. Mind you the yellow Z06 springs are excellent if you can get away with running them they last a very long time
I want a little chop at idle, this would be PERFECT :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7EBu4pCvZs
_________________ 2002 Pontaic Trans-Am WS.6
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Thu Oct 14, 2010 2:01 pm |
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cam
Senior Forum User
Joined: Sun May 13, 2007 10:48 am Posts: 984
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Chop is easy with any of the cams your looking at just lower your idle...
Mind you the 224/228 will be at about the limits for a street cam imo. Once you crest the 230 duration with stock cubes it becomes a bit uncivilized for daily driver type use. Plus your power band starts to shift too high in the RPM band to make use of it on the street and it'll be boggy down low.
As for the clutch as mentioned above it probably wont last long if you track it at all but once its cooked I cant say enough good things about the LS7 set up for the street. Great holding power and took a beating from HELL from me and still looks like new. Stock pedal feel and pressure too
_________________ 1987 IROC ww 99 LS1,TR224/112, STG2 heads ported by American Speed, P Gold springs, LS6 intake, SVO 30's, Ported TB, Comp Cromo Push rods, Katech Rod bolts, LS6 oil pump, T56, SW LT's, 8.8 hybrid rear 3.73, 275/40/17 MT ET streets, lots more
12.1 @ 112 mph 1.69 60'
89 R7U 1LE Players Challenge car all stock.
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Thu Oct 14, 2010 2:09 pm |
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Mark99Hawk
Forum Moderator
Joined: Wed Oct 25, 2006 7:08 pm Posts: 144
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Mine has a bit of a chop...but nothing serious. If you are in town you can hear it in person No clips of it though.
I hear ya on stock pushrods. I figure I don't turn more than 6200-6300 RPM and have bent a few before on a missed shift (I also bent a bunch of valves). When I put them in I figured it was a "fuse" of sorts in the valvetrain in case something went horribly wrong again Like I said though - any heavier springs or any more RPM and I wouldn't use stock ones.
Mark
_________________'99 Red Firehawk C069
One of 97 that never left Canada in '99
Lots of SLP options
Sold - '97 Cayenne Red Z28
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Thu Oct 14, 2010 2:10 pm |
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